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Post by GatorAid on Apr 5, 2023 2:40:38 GMT
Making this thread to talk about the total lack of guts had in the modern Dogo in other countries. Many are great, but many are also total shit. American Bulldogs consistently throw out hard luggers everywhere, but not Dogos. In cages they've been cheerleaders basically while APBTs do the work. Dogo x pit is common to make Dogos actually worth something. Dogos seem to be uniquely shitty, throwing out terrible individuals a concerning amount of the time. And then also outside of rural Argentina they are inflated to outrageous sizes, 140-150lbs for many. WTF? Are they down the drain already? Starting to think so, not just "getting there" but no, they are. wyatt gunb |
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gunb
New Member
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Post by gunb on Apr 5, 2023 4:37:12 GMT
Lots of lineages of dogo definitely are, especially in the USA and Europe and even many in South America too. But just when I think they're totally fucked I'll see a legit one doing something pretty impressive. I guess still I agree because those impressive ones are nearly always rural Argentinian. It shouldn't be surprising that pet or show lines of any purebreed are junk. The answer to "is breed X ruined?" is always yes, it doesn't matter which breed. But it also doesn't matter which breed when you're talking about serious working dogs, if they're there in that world they are legit,even if they're a ruined breed.
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Post by GatorAid on Apr 5, 2023 4:54:02 GMT
Lots of lineages of dogo definitely are, especially in the USA and Europe and even many in South America too. But just when I think they're totally fucked I'll see a legit one doing something pretty impressive. I guess still I agree because those impressive ones are nearly always rural Argentinian. It shouldn't be surprising that pet or show lines of any purebreed are junk. The answer to "is breed X ruined?" is always yes, it doesn't matter which breed. But it also doesn't matter which breed when you're talking about serious working dogs, if they're there in that world they are legit,even if they're a ruined breed. I think the Galgo Patagonico and Dogal are better than pure Dogos. Like if I were to get a catch dog from South America, regardless of running ability, I'd go for a 3/4th Dogal. Then I know its breeding is legit and they aren't being bred for purity. Would you agree with that sentiment? |
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wyatt
New Member
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Post by wyatt on Apr 5, 2023 7:36:01 GMT
Making this thread to talk about the total lack of guts had in the modern Dogo in other countries. Many are great, but many are also total shit. American Bulldogs consistently throw out hard luggers everywhere, but not Dogos. In cages they've been cheerleaders basically while APBTs do the work. Dogo x pit is common to make Dogos actually worth something. Dogos seem to be uniquely shitty, throwing out terrible individuals a concerning amount of the time. And then also outside of rural Argentina they are inflated to outrageous sizes, 140-150lbs for many. WTF? Are they down the drain already? Starting to think so, not just "getting there" but no, they are. wyatt gunb You’re correct. So many lines of Dogos have produced standoffish and abnormal Dogos that the breed itself can be considered as “went to shit.” There are some guys who will die on the hill that of the Dogo Argentino but the hype doesn’t even get me. Theres a National Geographic video that includes the founder of the Dogo Argentino Club Of America. In this he spreads a lot of misinformation out to the public. Some quotes that I need to address. “The Dogo Argentino is fearless, aggressive, and strong.” Strong and aggressive yes, but fearless? If this is the case why do we see so many standoffish Dogos? Why do we see so many Dogos being abnormal from the breed? All of this isn’t adding up. ”These dogs don’t have the same fear of injury a wolf has” Both wolves and dogs (which are the same thing colloquially) have subjugation roles in their packs and can be used under the same circumstances. To say a Dogo has less of a fear of a injury a wolf has is only subjective. A subjugation wolf could be considered fearless too. And yes, abandoning self-preservation is what catch dogs do. But this comes from the wolf. Subjugation wolves will also risk their self-preservation for their pack to dispatch. Like that photo you saw of the wolf grabbing the ear of the wild boar, was a subjugation wolf. That wolf deliberately risked their self-preservation for the rest of the pack to dispatch. To summarize, the entire evolutionary purpose of subjugation is to risk self-preservation. Its not anything new. “The dogs will not kill the animal” Uh, what? Then why the fuck would they be subjugating it? Then why the fuck would it be a hunt? The dogs do kill the wild boar/feral pig, the video worded it entirely wrong. Yes, that is not the primary thing that happens. But the reason the dogs don’t kill the wild boar/feral pig is simply because of the human in the hunt interrupting it with a knife. They subjugate it for the human to take it down, like they do with the rest of their pack. Killing is the entire point of subjugation, it just has to be done by packmates. The National Geographic video: |
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Post by GatorAid on Apr 5, 2023 7:41:50 GMT
Making this thread to talk about the total lack of guts had in the modern Dogo in other countries. Many are great, but many are also total shit. American Bulldogs consistently throw out hard luggers everywhere, but not Dogos. In cages they've been cheerleaders basically while APBTs do the work. Dogo x pit is common to make Dogos actually worth something. Dogos seem to be uniquely shitty, throwing out terrible individuals a concerning amount of the time. And then also outside of rural Argentina they are inflated to outrageous sizes, 140-150lbs for many. WTF? Are they down the drain already? Starting to think so, not just "getting there" but no, they are. wyatt gunb You’re correct. So many lines of Dogos have produced standoffish and abnormal Dogos that the breed itself can be considered as “went to shit.” There are some guys who will die on the hill that of the Dogo Argentino but the hype doesn’t even get me. Theres a National Geographic video that includes the founder of the Dogo Argentino Club Of America. In this he spreads a lot of misinformation out to the public. Some quotes that I need to address. “The Dogo Argentino is fearless, aggressive, and strong.” Strong and aggressive yes, but fearless? If this is the case why do we see so many standoffish Dogos? Why do we see so many Dogos being abnormal from the breed? All of this isn’t adding up. ”These dogs don’t have the same fear of injury a wolf has” Both wolves and dogs (which are the same thing colloquially) have subjugation roles in their packs and can be used under the same circumstances. To say a Dogo has less of a fear of a injury a wolf has is only subjective. A subjugation wolf could be considered fearless too. And yes, abandoning self-preservation is what catch dogs do. But this comes from the wolf. Subjugation wolves will also risk their self-preservation for their pack to dispatch. Like that photo you saw of the wolf grabbing the ear of the wild boar, was a subjugation wolf. That wolf deliberately risked their self-preservation for the rest of the pack to dispatch. To summarize, the entire evolutionary purpose of subjugation is to risk self-preservation. Its not anything new. “The dogs will not kill the animal” Uh, what? Then why the fuck would they be subjugating it? Then why the fuck would it be a hunt? The dogs do kill the wild boar/feral pig, the video worded it entirely wrong. Yes, that is not the primary thing that happens. But the reason the dogs don’t kill the wild boar/feral pig is simply because of the human in the hunt interrupting it with a knife. They subjugate it for the human to take it down, like they do with the rest of their pack. Killing is the entire point of subjugation, it just has to be done by packmates. The National Geographic video: Yeah most of us southerners see this and go "ha, dogos are so shit... ambull wouldn't let your ass get hurt like that, a real bulldog never lets go. yeah screw dogos they're a kitchen sink lurcher piece of shit." Count on a Dogo to get you hurt real bad if you are using it anywhere other than rural Argentina from proven lines. |
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gunb
New Member
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Post by gunb on Apr 5, 2023 14:30:35 GMT
Lots of lineages of dogo definitely are, especially in the USA and Europe and even many in South America too. But just when I think they're totally fucked I'll see a legit one doing something pretty impressive. I guess still I agree because those impressive ones are nearly always rural Argentinian. It shouldn't be surprising that pet or show lines of any purebreed are junk. The answer to "is breed X ruined?" is always yes, it doesn't matter which breed. But it also doesn't matter which breed when you're talking about serious working dogs, if they're there in that world they are legit,even if they're a ruined breed. I think the Galgo Patagonico and Dogal are better than pure Dogos. Like if I were to get a catch dog from South America, regardless of running ability, I'd go for a 3/4th Dogal. Then I know its breeding is legit and they aren't being bred for purity. Would you agree with that sentiment? Think GPs and Dogals are just fundamentally better, even if you had best of the best of each the GP and dogal are just better recipes. Dogos have a weird balance of ingredients for my taste, they didn't need half the stupid random breeds they put into them. The brothers who started the breed were just con men really, they turned out "good enough" for serious country guys to work with but I think they pretty quickly realised they are better crossed. Pure dogos aren't that common in serious rural working dog populations of argentina. This is what actual working running catch dogs look like there-  |
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Post by GatorAid on Apr 5, 2023 18:04:45 GMT
I think the Galgo Patagonico and Dogal are better than pure Dogos. Like if I were to get a catch dog from South America, regardless of running ability, I'd go for a 3/4th Dogal. Then I know its breeding is legit and they aren't being bred for purity. Would you agree with that sentiment? Think GPs and Dogals are just fundamentally better, even if you had best of the best of each the GP and dogal are just better recipes. Dogos have a weird balance of ingredients for my taste, they didn't need half the stupid random breeds they put into them. The brothers who started the breed were just con men really, they turned out "good enough" for serious country guys to work with but I think they pretty quickly realised they are better crossed. Pure dogos aren't that common in serious rural working dog populations of argentina. This is what actual working running catch dogs look like there- My biggest question with the Dogo is "why pyrenees?" There are Dogos who pop up with thick pyr fur on occasion. It is a small but alarmingly high dose if that shit is happening. Which might add onto the Dogo's temperamental shortcomings sometimes. |
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gunb
New Member
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Post by gunb on Apr 5, 2023 19:54:53 GMT
Think GPs and Dogals are just fundamentally better, even if you had best of the best of each the GP and dogal are just better recipes. Dogos have a weird balance of ingredients for my taste, they didn't need half the stupid random breeds they put into them. The brothers who started the breed were just con men really, they turned out "good enough" for serious country guys to work with but I think they pretty quickly realised they are better crossed. Pure dogos aren't that common in serious rural working dog populations of argentina. This is what actual working running catch dogs look like there- My biggest question with the Dogo is "why pyrenees?" There are Dogos who pop up with thick pyr fur on occasion. It is a small but alarmingly high dose if that shit is happening. Which might add onto the Dogo's temperamental shortcomings sometimes. Yes couldn't have added a more stupid ingredient if they tried. Some say the original guy simply wanted a fighting dog, and it was later adopted by hunters. They even say the wolfhound got added after it was adopted by hunters, like 15 generations into the program. The mix is still idiotic, but somehow that would annoy me less. Intentionally adding pyrenees into a hunting dog makes me so mad. |
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wyatt
New Member
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Post by wyatt on Apr 5, 2023 20:40:46 GMT
My biggest question with the Dogo is "why pyrenees?" There are Dogos who pop up with thick pyr fur on occasion. It is a small but alarmingly high dose if that shit is happening. Which might add onto the Dogo's temperamental shortcomings sometimes. Yes couldn't have added a more stupid ingredient if they tried. Some say the original guy simply wanted a fighting dog, and it was later adopted by hunters. They even say the wolfhound got added after it was adopted by hunters, like 15 generations into the program. The mix is still idiotic, but somehow that would annoy me less. Intentionally adding pyrenees into a hunting dog makes me so mad. Adding Pyrenees into a catch dog is the equivalent of me adding Treeing Walker into a Cur dog. |
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Post by GatorAid on Apr 5, 2023 20:49:18 GMT
Yes couldn't have added a more stupid ingredient if they tried. Some say the original guy simply wanted a fighting dog, and it was later adopted by hunters. They even say the wolfhound got added after it was adopted by hunters, like 15 generations into the program. The mix is still idiotic, but somehow that would annoy me less. Intentionally adding pyrenees into a hunting dog makes me so mad. Adding Pyrenees into a catch dog is the equivalent of me adding Treeing Walker into a Cur dog. No, it's the equivalent of adding italian greyhound to a pointer, or a jindo to an irish wolfhound... well the latter is better than both of the formers to be fair. |
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Post by GatorAid on Apr 5, 2023 20:59:10 GMT
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